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Military selectors, pages, etc.
We know the desired endgame in Ukraine. It's too risky for Biden to share the particulars with Republicans.
By Curt_Anderson
September 22, 2023 11:38 am
Category: Military

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It's no secret that winning for Ukraine is to expel the Russian invaders from that country. That would not only be a win for Ukraine but for all who favor democracy over autocracy. It's also a win for the next countries that Putin covets and would invade if there was minimal resistance to Russian imperialist aggression.

No doubt Biden, Tony Blinken, Lloyd Austin, Zelensky and other officials have discussed the particulars on how that victory is to be accomplished. Maybe there are other details which include gelding the Russian bear and/or ousting Putin.

But can you imagine the dangers of Biden sharing any of that with Rand Paul or any other congressional Republicans? Either they'd blab the strategies and details directly to Putin or tell Trump which is tantamount to telling Putin.

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Comments on "We know the desired endgame in Ukraine. It's too risky for Biden to share the particulars with Republicans.":

  1. by HatetheSwamp on September 22, 2023 11:49 am

    It's the cost of leadership, Curt.

    I will give you the benefit of the doubt and grant that you believe what you write. I don't. I have no reason to.

    The truth is that the Doddering Old Fool sought the privileges and responsibility of being the President of the United States. He's as weak and feckless as any president in our history. Inept, too.

  2. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 11:55 am
    What don't you believe? That the goal is expel Russia from Ukraine? That Biden shouldn't share the particulars? That there are Republicans who side with Russia and/or could care less if Ukraine loses this fight and they would be happy to see the war end on Putin's terms?

  3. by HatetheSwamp on September 22, 2023 12:00 pm

    Curt,

    I believe that your last paragraph is horsepucky:

    But can you imagine the dangers of Biden sharing any of that with Rand Paul or any other congressional Republicans? Either they'd blab the strategies and details directly to Putin or tell Trump which is tantamount to telling Putin.

    Total and complete horsepucky.

  4. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 12:07 pm
    HtS,
    Sen John McCain on Sen. Rand Paul: "The Senator from Kentucky is now working for Vladimir Putin."


  5. by HatetheSwamp on September 22, 2023 12:22 pm

    Curt,

    As OD pointed out, he disagrees with Paul. I have been clear that I do, too.

    But, Senator Rand Paul is a traitor for disagreeing with the "feckless dementia-ridden piece of crap" on his handling of the war?

    You can't mean that.

  6. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 12:55 pm
    HtS,
    I didn't say Rand Paul was a traitor. A useful idiot, perhaps. Maybe a collaborationist. McCain said Rand Paul works for Putin. At any rate, Biden should never trust him with the particulars of our endgame in Ukraine.

    Kentucky Republican Sen. Rand Paul hobnobbed in Moscow with members of the Russian Council, sometimes called his "counterparts." These included the chairman of the council's foreign policy panel, Konstantin Kosachev, who happens to be under official U.S. sanction for his government's actions against our government.
    npr.org

  7. by HatetheSwamp on September 22, 2023 1:00 pm

    I didn't say Rand Paul was a traitor. I didn't say Rand Paul was a traitor.

    Of course you did.

    Kentucky Republican Sen. Rand Paul hobnobbed in Moscow with members of the Russian Council,...

    Two words:

    Bernie

    npr.org bahahahahahahahahahaha baha haha ha!

  8. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 1:26 pm
    HtS,
    You were the one who brought up the possibility that Rand Paul was a traitor. I just don't trust him. I am not saying all Republicans side with Russia, but they are not ashamed to be comrades.


  9. by Indy! on September 22, 2023 1:54 pm

    Citizens of earth are not afraid to be comrades with any nationality. It's only the nationalists and xenophobes who can't sympathize with people from another country. Something you might want to spend a little time considering, Curt. 😌


  10. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 2:02 pm
    Indy,
    You, my fellow Eartharian, and I are are not that different. I sympathize with the people of Ukraine. You sympathize with the people of Russia.

  11. by Indy! on September 22, 2023 2:26 pm

    Post anything of mine where I sympathized with the people of Russia (or the people of Ukraine).

    Then post something of yours proving you "sympathize(d)" with the people of Ukraine BEFORE the MIC's propaganda started a couple years ago when they decided the next "war" on their agenda would be Russia v. Ukraine. I've known you for what... a decade or more? And I can't remember anyone EVER even mentioning Ukraine on your board until the brainwashing began with Putin's full scale invasion iin 2022.

  12. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 2:37 pm
    “Post anything of mine where I sympathized with the people of Russia (or the people of Ukraine).”. —Indy

    So I take it you do not sympathize with people of either of those countries. What are you, some sort of nationalistic xenophobe?


  13. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 3:00 pm
    “Then post something of yours proving you "sympathize(d)" with the people of Ukraine BEFORE the MIC's propaganda started a couple years ago when they decided the next "war" on their agenda would be Russia v. Ukraine.”. —-Indy

    I have had sympathy for Ukraine since Trump’s "perfect phone call" when he tried to blackmail Zelensky. That wasn’t a couple of years ago but almost five years ago.

    selectsmart.com

  14. by oldedude on September 22, 2023 3:22 pm
    Back to the thread.
    curt- I know that pesky thing called the constitution is always in your way. Both the house and senate ARE REQUIRED to get briefed. So far, pedojoe has done that. (of course not him, but someone else that actually can answer questions on the particulars, which any president isn't required to know). For some reason, this is very much out of his character to follow protocol. Especially after he overrode the pentagon folks and handed Afghanistan to the IC. Which handed Afghans their arse.

  15. by Indy! on September 22, 2023 9:06 pm

    That SelectSmart article is from 2020 - not 2018. Has counting become problematic for you too?

  16. by Curt_Anderson on September 22, 2023 9:34 pm
    Indy,
    Yes, my post was more than three years old. Two years was the time limit you established. I didn't say my post was almost five years old. I said Trump's perfect phone call was almost five years ago. I certainly sympathized with Ukraine and discussed their need to have the deterrent weapons it needed (without Trump's blackmail) in the old forum before that.

  17. by HatetheSwamp on September 23, 2023 6:02 am

    HtS,
    You were the one who brought up the possibility that Rand Paul was a traitor.

    Really? Where!

  18. by Curt_Anderson on September 23, 2023 8:51 am
    HtS,
    You were the one who brought up the possibility that Rand Paul was a traitor.

    Really? Where!

    HtS,
    You were the first to use the word “traitor” in this thread. You raised the question in comment #5.

  19. by oldedude on September 23, 2023 9:55 am
    I've just been reading. It seems to me curt is (yet again) locked in that prison of two ideas. If you disagree with any of his swamp creatures, he, like the rest of the sheeple hate them and consider them enemies of the state. I liked McCain until that tumor grew too much (like my mom and her dementia) he turned liberal.

    That simply isn't so in a Republic. It's called "disagreement." That's all. In a sheeple's "government" you aren't allowed to disagree, disrespect, or carry on a discourse (unless it's a government against "them"). You must, without question, march to their tune (and toon) they create, regardless of the circumstances.

    This is the norm for the sheeple. There are no nuances (unless you're protecting your own, then you minimize and fabricate excuses, lies, reasons, and theories why your folks are not guilty. And the other side needs to be flogged and stoned in a pit.

    curt- you didn't bring up the word treason. Yet saying that a member of congress is working at the whim of a dictator (like Menendez) is treason. That's what this issue is about. I caught the inference also.

    Instead of saying "I didn't say 'treason,'" you could have clarified. You chose not to. Oh well.

  20. by HatetheSwamp on September 23, 2023 10:40 am

    Curt,

    Because you accused him of working for our enemy!

  21. by Curt_Anderson on September 23, 2023 10:45 am
    HtS,
    I didn’t accuse Rand Paul of working with the enemy, John McCain did.

  22. by HatetheSwamp on September 23, 2023 11:26 am

    Right. And, you quoted him to disagree? Baha

  23. by Curt_Anderson on September 23, 2023 11:45 am
    HtS,
    If you and OD don't like Rand Paul being called a traitor, can we at least agree that his vow to block any government funding in support of Ukraine's defense against Russia is music to Vladimir Putin's ears? In other words, Rand Paul is giving aid and comfort to the enemy.

    I suppose next you will say it's unfair of me to call Putin our enemy.

  24. by oldedude on September 23, 2023 12:17 pm
    If you and OD don't like Rand Paul being called a traitor, can we at least agree that his vow to block any government funding in support of Ukraine's defense against Russia is music to Vladimir Putin's ears?

    So you doubled down on calling him a traitor. After you said you didn't say that. Well Done! welldone.

    Let's "assume" that is your gold standard of being a traitor. That means 17 senators and 16 members of the house should have been tried over our involvement in Vietnam. And all 156 members of congress that were active in their non support of the Gulf War.

    You can't have it both ways. Although I suspect you really give it a try in a few minutes. Which is BS and proves my points above.

  25. by Curt_Anderson on September 23, 2023 1:26 pm
    OD,
    I didn't favor sending US troops to fight in Vietnam or the various Middle East countries, either. But we are not sending troops to Ukraine.

    People like the Ukrainians who are willing to put their lives on the line to fight on behalf of democracy and territorial integrity deserve our financial support. I approve of investing in people who are committed to democracy. I don't approve of propping up monarchies, autocrats or unpopular regimes.

  26. by HatetheSwamp on September 23, 2023 1:29 pm

    Curt,

    You are everything the blind supporters of the war in Vietnam were during the Johnson and Nixon years.

    Remember what they said about opponents of that war? Uncanny, eh?

  27. by oldedude on September 23, 2023 5:15 pm
    I didn't favor sending US troops to fight in Vietnam or the various Middle East countries, either. But we are not sending troops to Ukraine.

    As of now we are not sending troops to Ukraine.

    Do you understand what would happen if Putin did throw chemical weapons like he has done every other time when losing an insurgency war? Let's just say he throws them on a "military" target, but the wind shifts and it murders two towns? What is your reaction? Is it "halt! or I'll say halt again!" or some other foolishness?

    The Ukrainian forces can't retaliate, that's for sure. Legally, it's not really a NATO issue, but then again... Poland may want to retaliate because they're the ones that are next in the domino theory. Maybe they have some old sarin they could use on the Russians. Do you think that would help? Again, maybe bomb the crap out of Moscow and kill a couple of thousand Russian civilians.

    The question is; how do "we" fulfill our integrity and our steadfast retaliation against the use of chemical/ biological weapons (that only omomber has violated)? I would like to hear what your thoughts are about this. It's a very real possibility.

  28. by Curt_Anderson on September 23, 2023 6:01 pm
    Joe Biden was asked the same question on 60 Minutes one year ago. Biden wouldn't tell Scott Pelley what the response would be, except to say, "it'll be consequential".

    I do think that the Russian population needs to educated about their war--maybe with some tough lessons. Among other things we need to break through Putin's propaganda. I wouldn't rule out bombing inside Russia to slow their military machine.

    I'll share an anecdote with you. I visited my in-laws back east this summer. A cousin of my wife is married to a Ukrainian woman (Anna is multilingual and was working as a translator in NYC). Anna told me that her aunt moved to Moscow because of her job about ten years ago.

    Anyway, Anna was aghast that her aunt, a native Ukrainian, was parroting Putin's lies. Her aunt believed that Ukraine attacked Russia, that Russia is de-Nazifying Ukraine, that Russia is only attacking military targets, etc. Anna's mother, her aunt's sister, has had her town bombed and civilians were killed. Anna's aunt refuses to believe it. Anna became animated, irate and exasperated just telling us about her brainwashed aunt.


    cbsnews.com

  29. by oldedude on September 23, 2023 7:17 pm
    First, Hitting civilian targets purposefully is forbidden. There are a bunch of caveats to that. Like you can't hit a church, unless it has military uses (i.e. you're getting hit with sniper fire from the minaret). Hospitals are a common use item also. Trumpster was the best at retaliation that I've seen since carter, when I knew what the rules were. The Iranians hit one of our warships. Within 48 hours (maybe more like 36?) we did an airstrike on one of their command posts that killed one of their best generals (and of course all of his staff and leadership). Did not kill anyone we didn't want to kill, but we vaporized that general. And the Iranians knew it. Obviously, they didn't strike at our ships anymore in the Straits of Hormuz. There were a couple of fast boat episodes, but when we started shooting back with 30mm machine guns, they quit. Those were the best political uses of military might I've ever seen.

    I completely understand your anecdote. I've mentioned my daughter is Russian born, but now a US citizen. She tells the same stories. We've wondered though, if they say that over the phone because they're afraid of the government. They know they're being monitored, so I think it's a possibility. I do agree with you though, it's a mix of weirdness coming from there. Most of her "information" on child rearing comes from there. I've found it's a mix of old wives tales, superstition, and "medicine" we gave up in the 50's. She is pretty apolitical also.

  30. by Indy! on September 23, 2023 7:52 pm

    Curt's anecdote reminds me of the way I feel when I'm talking to Curt. 🤔

  31. by oldedude on September 23, 2023 8:28 pm
    When these folks get our (meaning western) "news" it's so much different than what they're used to. The level of propaganda is unbelievable to an American. And I have always said we're filled with propaganda.

    My daughter in law, honestly believed the SOUTH Koreans ate their young. They would kill them off (especially the girls) and eat them. This was something she was taught.

    The flip side is that she is deathly afraid of having a "gay" child. She has never mentioned a TS child because I believe she can't imagine that in her reality. That's straight out of Putin's policies. She "accepts" my beliefs in this area but isn't in agreement. (The Russian culture is supposedly extremely patriarchal. But the grandmothers wield a lot of power also. They're more the meddlers that tell you how to raise your children)

    Their entire school system is built around the propaganda, although their university system is unbelievable. Especially in the arts. She came over with a Russian "BA" degree and with the hours, it translated into a Masters with two BAs. So she has a MA in accounting, a BA in accounting, a BA in Music (classic Russian piano).

  32. by Indy! on September 23, 2023 9:14 pm

    Interesting.

  33. by HatetheSwamp on September 24, 2023 3:59 am

    Interesting, indeed.

  34. by Ponderer on September 24, 2023 8:00 am

    Anna's aunt seems to be suffering from the same willful ignorance that has allowed too many on the right in this country to ignore and defend what their party and it's current leader have actually been doing to this country and to them. The lies they accept as truth are in stark contrast to the realities of their eyes and ears. But the lies are what they want to hear, so it becomes their reality. The truth can go fuckitself as far as they are concerned.


  35. by oldedude on September 24, 2023 8:07 am
    I was agreeing with curt. If that is the ONLY news you get all your life, you'll believe it. Period. End of story. Regardless of how stupid it sounds when you leave country.

    The lies they accept as truth are in stark contrast to the realities of their eyes and ears.

    You don't get it. THAT is what they see and hear with their own eyes and ears on their news. That is their reality.

    This is another case of your perception is not the perception of another.

  36. by Ponderer on September 24, 2023 8:17 am

    Right. Exactly. Just as those like Hate who only get their news from Fox and other sites regurgitating the same exact propaganda that is in total contradiction to objective, observable reality.



    See gang? olde dude gets it!


  37. by HatetheSwamp on September 24, 2023 8:28 am

    Exactly. Just as those like Hate who only get their news from Fox...

    Translation:

    I HAVE FDS, TOO!
    I HAVE FDS, TOO!
    I HAVE FDS, TOO!
    I HAVE FDS, TOO!
    I HAVE FDS, TOO!

    Sad. Sick!

    Bahahahahahahahahahaha ha ha baha baha, ha!

  38. by oldedude on September 24, 2023 8:33 am
    Or only from MSN... or only Muffie.

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