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Government selectors, pages, etc.
Happy INSURRECTION Day!!!!!
By HatetheSwamp
January 6, 2023 4:11 am
Category: Government

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One thing freethinking people have confirmed, in the wake of the Stalinesque J6 Show Trial, is that there was no insurrection. So, you who are so deranged as to think that there was one, and, as the song says:

CELEBRATE, GOOD TIMES. COME ON!

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Comments on "Happy INSURRECTION Day!!!!!":

  1. by oldedude on January 6, 2023 10:50 am
    Looks like after all the incessant whining, beaching, wasting time on a "trial that wasn't, and yet witnesses were sworn in, expected to tell the truth under perjury laws, official notes were taken, and they had the ability to deny one or more citizens something of value. No one is interested when the door actually opens.


  2. by oldedude on January 8, 2023 5:33 am
    Ya know, I thought they would be celebrating like the Brits celebrate Guy Fawkes Day. Hanging people in effigy on the DC mall (or maybe finding a real person in a red hat, if it's a MAGA cap or not). Or maybe they'll burn down a city or two, just to "celebrate."


  3. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 6:39 am

    OD,

    My sense of the recognition of the anniversary of J6 by the Blue MAGAs is that it was rather muted. No doubt, members of the progressive Swampcult were distracted by the GOP's struggles to settle the Speaker election, but still...

    Whadaya think? Could it be that the rational people on the left, i.e., people who are liberal and progressive but don't have TDS, understand the monumental failure of the J6 Committee and are more than happy to allow that sad moment in our history fade into memory?

    You and I agree about both J6 and Trump. As patriots, we were quick to condemn the riot. We think Trump is despicable and don't support him. What I'm asking is if you think that the mainstream among Dems is now on board, on those issues, with OD and pb.


  4. by Donna on January 8, 2023 8:16 am

    What's next, Happy Pearl Harbor Day? Happy Memorial Day?


  5. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 8:25 am

    Actually, I was specting gatherings of TDSers engaged in weeping and gnashing of teeth and the hanging of Trump in effigy with great fanfare.


  6. by Donna on January 8, 2023 8:30 am

    That would've made you happy?


  7. by oldedude on January 8, 2023 8:56 am
    I think the rational mainstream is. I keep looking at Harold Ford Jr. The fact that as a Dem he can actually look at both sides. It makes me want to listen to his viewpoints more. He and Dana (that's an hour out of my 1.5 hours of TV "news") are worth listening to. You may not agree, but you should listen to what they say. They're voices are well worthwhile.

    So I guess there are the fringes of the always trumpsters and TDS. Both are impossible to talk to. A lot of conservatives are like you and me. Trump is a flash in the pan, a true PITA, but there's a lot more going on in the world worth looking at.


  8. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 9:38 am

    Donna,

    It wouldn't have me happy. It'd have amused me just as I was amused on the original J6 and J7 when TDSers, including TDSers on SS, passed judgment on Trump for having planned and led an insurrection...which we know now he didn't.

    I find some of the various forms of mental illness, well, entertaining. TDS in particular.


  9. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 9:47 am

    Bang on, OD!

    I groove on Dana and I love the days that Ford, Jr is on The Five. As far as I can tell neither MSNBC nor CNN have anyone like them. I'm sure that's why the show is the most viewed cable news program, even though it's an afternoon show.

    The days when rational Dems and rational GOPs engaged in meaningful dialog is nearly gone, but there's still a few like Dana and Ford. Here's to having more on both sides.


  10. by Donna on January 8, 2023 11:38 am

    We don't know if Trump planned the insurrection, but he certainly egged it on and appeared to be very pleased about it. Our justice system will decide if he took part in planning it.



  11. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 11:55 am

    All your Stalinesque hearings of two years came up with is what he may or may not have done for 187 minutes after the riot began.


  12. by oldedude on January 8, 2023 12:49 pm
    I have a feeling there's going to be a lot of video starring Maxine Watters, little nancy, etcetcetc as comparison. If he's guilty, so are they.


  13. by Donna on January 8, 2023 1:29 pm

    It's useless to argue with either of you, so I won't even try.


  14. by oldedude on January 8, 2023 2:26 pm
    Neither of us were arguing.


  15. by HatetheSwamp on January 8, 2023 3:37 pm

    Yeah, Donna. We weren't arguing.


  16. by Ponderer on January 10, 2023 9:41 am

    "there was no insurrection." -Hate

    What is it that you have against the English language, Bill? Why do you feel so driven to deny what English words mean?


    insurrection
    [ in-suh-rek-shuhn ]
    noun
    1. an act or instance of rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance against civil authority or an established government.


  17. by HatetheSwamp on January 10, 2023 10:19 am

    po,
    Correct me if I'm wrong. To this point, no one has been charged with insurrection for J6.
    law.cornell.edu


  18. by Ponderer on January 10, 2023 10:41 am

    "Correct me if I'm wrong. To this point, no one has been charged with insurrection for J6." -Hate

    Well... of course not. What a straw man.

    Nearly a thousand people have been charged and many already convicted for their participation in an "insurrection" though. Pretty much the same thing.
    insider.com


  19. by HatetheSwamp on January 10, 2023 10:54 am

    insider.com eh? Another progressive SwampMedia propaganda site.

    There's no doubt that many have been convicted as a result of their involvement in the J6 Capitol riot...which pb condemned contemporaneously...but the fact that SwampMedia TDSers call that an insurrection doesn't make it one.


  20. by Ponderer on January 10, 2023 11:55 am

    "...but the fact that SwampMedia TDSers call that an insurrection doesn't make it one. Hate

    No. You are absolutely right. It doesn't.



    The fact that the dictionary defines it as one does.


  21. by Ponderer on January 10, 2023 11:57 am

    Someone killed your puppy with an unabridged Oxford English Dictionary when you were a little kid, didn't they.......

    .


  22. by oldedude on January 10, 2023 2:34 pm
    Most insurrections in the past 250 years started in the streets. Not by one side holding a federal building and giving it up after a couple of hours.


  23. by Ponderer on January 10, 2023 3:30 pm

    "Most insurrections in the past 250 years started in the streets. Not by one side holding a federal building and giving it up after a couple of hours." -olde dude


    That's as may be.

    But as your very statement logically suggests is possible, and vast mountains of evidence, charges, and convictions are proof of... at leastone was.


  24. by oldedude on January 10, 2023 8:19 pm
    You completely missed my point. As usual.


  25. by Ponderer on January 11, 2023 6:43 am

    "You completely missed my point. As usual." -olde dude

    Wasn't your point that "Most insurrections in the past 250 years started in the streets. Not by one side holding a federal building and giving it up after a couple of hours."? It's the only thing you've said to me in this thread, so I assume that it's the point you are talking about me missing.

    I didn't miss it. I took it to mean exactly what it said. I even agree with it!

    And even if I agree with your point that most insurrections in the past 250 years started in the streets, and not by one side holding a federal building and giving it up after a couple of hours, that would logically suggest that some insurrections are not like what you say "most" are. You understand that when you say "most" that it implies the remainder as "some", don't you?

    It sounds like for the sake of argument, you are wanting the word most to mean all.

    Is your point that since "most" insurrections in the past 250 years started in the streets and not by one side holding a federal building and giving it up after a couple of hours, that therefore it is by some stretch of logic impossible for the 1/6 insurrection to have qualified as one, because it didn't conform to what most insurrections are like?

    Are you trying to suggest that since most insurrections are as you describe, that that means that all other insurrections not included in your use of the word most are that same way too...?


  26. by oldedude on January 11, 2023 8:42 am
    Some insurrections start by assassinations of government officials and the oligarchy. If you can think of one that started by taking over a building of the cantral government, where the insurrectionists left the premises after a couple of hours. Let me know. I'm all ears.


  27. by Ponderer on January 11, 2023 8:49 am

    *sigh*



    insurrection
    [ in-suh-rek-shuhn ]
    noun
    1. an act or instance of rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance against civil authority or an established government.



    Why is it that you and Hate think that you are completely free to simply make up whatever meaning you want a word to have to suit your own purposes?


  28. by oldedude on January 11, 2023 8:59 am
    I knew you would intentionally sharpshoot me. I can't think of one. I think the sheep don't use the word correctly, which shows by the charges. If no one is charged with that, how can you claim it was one except to feed you own ego?

    Again, I can't think of one. Even through the Arab Spring. The one that came closest was the shortest one. In Oman. People demonstrated outside the palace. Sultan Said bin Taimur, went out, greeted the protesters, and asked for the ringleaders. He and the ringleaders went inside the palace, and the Sultan ordered lunch be brought out to the protesters. The terms were agreed to, and the "Arab Spring" was over in Oman.

    SO other than that, If you have something, I'm all ears.


  29. by HatetheSwamp on January 11, 2023 9:28 am

    Why is it that you and Hate think that you are completely free to simply make up whatever meaning you want a word to have to suit your own purposes?

    This coming from you, of all of us, po? Pot to kettle.


    Note to isle. See? po brazenly acknowledges convicting Orangey from the beginning.


  30. by oldedude on January 11, 2023 9:28 am
    insurrection
    [ in-suh-rek-shuhn ]
    noun
    1. an act or instance of rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance against civil authority or an established government.



    Why is it that you and Hate think that you are completely free to simply make up whatever meaning you want a word to have to suit your own purposes?


    It looks like to me, that this was more you "summer of love" event. Question. Did the protesters leave? and how long did it take? Like I said before, revolts, rebellions don't get asked to leave and they do.

    They would have taken hostages. Murdered all the cops in there. Or taken them hostage, strip them of their equipment, and used them to negotiate with the government. They would have demands for the government. If this was a part of a rebellion, they would have shot someone, and tossed their body out a window just to show they were serious.

    I think you "think that you are completely free to simply make up whatever meaning you want a word to have to suit your own purposes?"


  31. by Ponderer on January 11, 2023 10:30 am

    olde dude, you are still arguing that your definition of the word insurrection is the only one that matters and whatever the dictionary says it means can go take a flying fukk at the moon.

    I am not the one making up my own definition of the word. I am going by the standard, dictionary definition of the word.

    It's simple: I am right and you are wrong. And I have provided proof of my correctness.

    You are incapable of presenting any evidence showing me that the dictionary is wrong.

    So again, you are wrong.


  32. by oldedude on January 12, 2023 2:40 am
    And my point is that you are using your own. You're using a dictionary. I'm using the legal definition. They're different. The legal term is narrower than the dictionary's definition. So honestly, we're both using a legit definition, but when talking about someone being arrested, I'll use the legal definition from the jurisdiction where it happened. That's all. If you want to keep fighting, you know I can. I'd rather not though.


  33. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 4:03 am

    You're right, OD. It's irrelevant to this exchange what the Merriam-Webster definition of insurrection is. The issue is what the term means in THE INSURRECTION ACT.

    po's doing nuthin but playing silly word games. isle was doing precisely that a few days ago, but this is not a game show. It's the real world.

    Even then, based on the failures of the J6 Committee, Trump can't be connected to an insurrection by any definition.
    brennancenter.org


  34. by Donna on January 12, 2023 5:44 am

    Rebellion and Insurrection, Sedition, and Treason

    The prohibition on rebellion and insurrection arises in a brief passage found iná18 U.S.C. Section 2383. The law prohibits the incitement, assistance, and participation in a rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States and its laws. The punishment for this crime is a fine, a maximum sentence of 10 years in federal prison, and ineligibility for public office.

    Rebellion and insurrection refer specifically to acts of violence against the state or its officers. This distinguishes the crime fromásedition, which is the organized incitement to rebellion or civil disorder against the authority of the state. It also separates the crime fromátreason, which is the violation of allegiance owed to one's country by betrayal or acting to aid the country's enemies.

    The crimes are easily confused, but if the party wasn't acting on behalf of (or giving aid to) a foreign government they are unlikely to be charged with treason. Calls to rise up against the authority of the government by staging non-violent protests and strikes might be characterized as sedition (if they violated laws relating to these acts), but wouldn't be considered rebellion or insurrection unless the incitement included calls for violent acts such as the destruction of government property or the assault of officers of the state.

    findlaw.com


  35. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 6:09 am

    Thanks for that, Donna.

    So, based even on the innuendo accumulated by the J6 Committee, do you think Trump is guilty? Of what? Based on what?


  36. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 6:21 am

    Thanks, bun! 😘


    "po's doing nuthin but playing silly word games." -Hate

    Yeah, no. Dear god the projection on you two.

    What I was doing is called "correcting". It could also be called "educating" or "enlightening" or "instructing". All of these are words that perfectly describe what I've done for him, as per their dictionary definitions.

    olde dude was wrong about what the word "insurrection" means and I simply corrected him by providing the standard and correct meaning of the word along with documented and long standing evidence of his error.

    olde dude is of course free to present support for his demonstrably false assertion that the "legal" definition of the word means something completely different that contradicts what Donna found. Perhaps he can indulge us by providing an excerpt from some huge legal tome out of his vast law library that he amassed from back in his old country horseback lawyering days where he got his definition from............

    (I understand that it may take a while for him to dig it up out of the rooms full of legal books he must have, so I'll be patient. Do you use a Dewey Decimal System type of organization, od?)


  37. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 6:29 am

    "So, based even on the innuendo accumulated by the J6 Committee, do you think Trump is guilty? Of what? Based on what?" -Hate

    Based on the sworn testimonies given under oath and penalty of law during the 1/6 hearings (Not sure what "innuendo" you're referring to) and the vast video and audio evidence presented by Trump himself, I think there's a charge or two that can be handed down based on this....

    18 U.S. Code ž 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection

    Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

    (It's all pretty damning for him, but I think the "aid and comfort" part is a slam dunk).

    law.cornell.edu


  38. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 6:30 am

    For the sake of connecting to the real world, I'll repeat my earlier question. Has anyone been charged with insurrection in connection with J6?


  39. by Donna on January 12, 2023 6:30 am

    You're welcome.

    I'm not a legal expert (and neither is anyone here,) so I'll wait and see what the courts decide, which will probably take another 18 to 24 months.


  40. by Donna on January 12, 2023 6:40 am

    As Sheri said, the "aid and comfort" part does seem like a slam dunk because we have Trump on camera doing that. I've heard more than one legal expert say, though, that convicting him of insurrection would be the most difficult charge to prove of the four proposed by the J6 Committee.


  41. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 6:41 am

    Could you provide a link?


  42. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 6:46 am

    "For the sake of connecting to the real world [sic], I'll repeat my earlier question. Has anyone been charged with insurrection in connection with J6?" -Hate

    And I'll repeat my earlier answer. People have been charged with participating in an insurrection in several ways and even convicted. It matters not that they weren't charged with "Insurrection in the First Degree", or whatever you supposedly think is the only thing that counts.

    What a ridiculous straw man.

    It's not gonna matter a damn to me what Trump is finally charged and convicted for, so long as he can never run for any public office again.

    And some time in Rikers, along with the former COO and now convicted felon of his now feloneous and real estate company is gonna do would of course be quite nice.


  43. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 6:49 am

    So, in a word, "No."


  44. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 7:03 am

    Am I correct, po, that you relish a presidential debate between "that feckless dementia-ridden piece of crap," or Kacklin Kammy, and Ron DeSantis or Nikki Haley?

    Well, me too!!!!!


  45. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 7:04 am

    A link? You saw the speech he gave in front of that knowingly armed hoard of his devotees that he himself set up to be there. You heard him giving aid and comfort to them yourself.

    Many times during his 11,000 word speech laced liberally with encouragement for his armed followers to fight for his lie which they had so willingly swallowed. He told them at one point to "Fight like hell", because if they didn't, they wouldn't have had any country any more.

    Yeah yeah yeah. I know. During that 11,000 word speech, he used the word "peacefully" once. And that was a totally transparent, lame, tongue-in-cheek attempt to protect himself from legal responsibility. You could even hear people laughing in the crowd.

    And you somehow believe that his throwing that word in there totally exonerates him of any criminal wrong doing, as did he, in his actions that day and in previous months leading up to it.

    That's what you think because you dutifully support him and don't want to see him charged and convicted of his crimes. Which is disgustingly un-American.

    You despicables of a feather sure stick together.


  46. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 7:14 am

    You're correct that I watched the speech in the moment.

    I neither saw nor heard a single thing that came close to aiding or comforting either a rebellion or an insurrection againstthegovernment. Not even close. And, of the two of us, I'm the one who's maintained rationality as far as OrangeMan is concerned.


  47. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 7:18 am

    "I neither saw nor heard a single thing that came close to aiding or comforting either a rebellion or an insurrection against the government. Not even close." -Hate


    "A blind man is in no place to describe what sighted people have seen" -Ponderoditus of Crete

    It goes just as well for the willfully blind.


  48. by Donna on January 12, 2023 7:21 am

    Trump giving aid and comfort to the insurrectionists after over three hours of silence as they attacked police officers and broke into and ransacked our Capitol building while the House was certifying the electoral count which 147 House members, all Republican, voted against:

    m.youtube.com


  49. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 7:30 am

    Donna is spot on. Even the appallingly irresponsible inaction on his part can be legally construed as giving "aid and comfort" to the insurrectionists.

    And I am sure that the DOJ will see it as such also.


  50. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 7:42 am

    Honestly, we're back to three hours of doing nuthin?

    Can you imagine making a case for any kind of a serious criminal charge against Trump, knowing that his attorney would play a video of Trump exhorting the crowd to move "PEACEFULLY" to the Capitol?, knowing that, Trump's attorneys would solicit testimony from convicted rioters who've already acknowledged that they did what they did on their own because all Trump wanted to do was talk!!!!!?

    Even if you got a conviction in front of a DC jury, the conviction would be appealed.

    Donna, po,

    I think Trump is despicable. I condemned the riot while it was taking place. But, rationally, I can't see it. I can't imagine, American jurisprudence being what it is, that there's a snowball's chance in hell that Trump will be held accountable for the J6 riot.

    Nor, should he be.


  51. by Donna on January 12, 2023 7:49 am

    You'll probably be right, Hts. The L.A. D.A. couldn't prove that O.J. murdered Nicole Brown and Ron Goldman either.


  52. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 7:52 am

    Bill, seriously. You don't have to keep going into the details of your willful blindness and ignorance. We get it already.

    You can't see what was plainly in view for all to observe. We get it. You're hanging on legal theories that you pulled out of your ass and will have no merit at all when they get to court.

    So Trump was just kidding with the dozens of calls to steadfastly fight against the legal and official results of the 2020 election he made in that speech to his armed followers I guess? The only time he was truly serious was that one time he threw the word "peacefully" into his speech.

    You got nothing, Bill.


  53. by HatetheSwamp on January 12, 2023 7:55 am

    You can't see what was plainly in view for all to observe.

    Not even close...You're centering the universe again.


  54. by Ponderer on January 12, 2023 8:13 am

    "All" even includes you, Bill. And all the other MAGA Hats.

    It's in view for all to see.

    That doesn't mean that all will choose to see it, just as you refuse to. It's still there for everyone to see.


  55. by oldedude on January 12, 2023 7:32 pm
    Pond-

    You're just an angry old hag.


  56. by HatetheSwamp on January 13, 2023 3:47 am

    po,

    pb angry. You must be projecting TDS anger.

    I guaran-EFFIN-tee you. Every one of pb's bahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha heeheeheeheeheeheehee hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha, ahhhhhhhhhhh-s...

    ...is absolutely honest and sincere.

    pb hasn't had this much fun in a looooooooong time! And, he thanks all you TDSers.

    Bahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha heeheeheeheeheeheehee hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha hoohoohoohoohoohoohoo heeheeheeheeheeheehee hahahahahahahahaha, ahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!


  57. by Ponderer on January 13, 2023 6:58 am

    "You're just an angry old hag.", -olde dude

    Among other things.


  58. by oldedude on January 13, 2023 7:58 am
    We finally agree on something. I would have used crone, but that would imply you had some respect.


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