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FLA & CRT: Sometimes it helps to know what the hell you are talking about.

By Curt_Anderson
November 30, 2022 11:19 am
Category: Education

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Rather than relying on Tucker Carlson or others in the news media for an interpretation of legislation, it's a good idea to read the actual language of the bill. See the links below.

Nowhere in the bill or its summary are the words Critical Race Theory or CRT.

The bill is actually called "CS/HB 7— Individual Freedom". It should have been called the "Protection of Conservative Snowflakes' Feelings Act". It hamstrings educators who might want to teach about aspects of American history that from our 21st century perspective are embarrassing or shameful.

A good subtitle of the bill might have been the "Florida's Anti-Critical Thinking Act of 2022". Some of the best classes in history I've ever had challenged the students and elicited robust discussions.

The language of CS/HB 7— Individual Freedom is followed by a laundry list:.

The bill specifies that subjecting any individual, as a condition of employment, membership, certification, licensing, credentialing, or passing an examination, to training, instruction, or any other required activity; or subjecting any K-20 public education student or employee to training or instruction, that espouses, promotes, advances, inculcates, or compels such individual to believe the following concepts constitutes an unlawful employment practice or unlawful discrimination:


On that list is this entry:
A person, by virtue of his or her race, color, sex, or national origin, bears personal responsibility for and must feel guilt, anguish, or other forms of psychological distress because of actions, in which the person played no part, committed in the past by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex.


Who is to know what history lesson might make a person "feel guilt, anguish, or other forms of psychological distress"? There are a lot events in American history that have a racial or religious component including slavery, treatment of Native Americans, Japanese internment during WWII, Jim Crow, the Chinese Exclusion Act, anti-Semitism, anti-Irish policies, mistreatment of immigrants, etc.

Cited and related links:

  1. flsenate.gov
  2. flsenate.gov

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Comments on "FLA & CRT: Sometimes it helps to know what the hell you are talking about.":

  1. by Donna on November 30, 2022 11:39 am

    My Black 7th grade American History teacher opened my eyes to a lot of injustices that Whites inflicted on Blacks, but never did I internalize that or feel guilty about it.

    "A person, by virtue of his or her race, color, sex, or national origin, bears personal responsibility for and must feel guilt, anguish, or other forms of psychological distress because of actions, in which the person played no part, committed in the past by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex."

    First of all, no one can make you feel anything. If you've been allowing people to make you feel a certain ways about yourself, then IMO you're going about life wrong.

    If a teacher is trying to do that to their students and my child was one of their students, I'd schedule a meeting with the teacher, make my feelings known, and take it from there.

    I seriously doubt, though, if that's in the curriculum. Hts and od, swear it is, and I'm like "Okay, then show me the curriculum", which they have yet to provide.


  2. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 11:46 am
    You "say" you've been a victim of homophobes. Got it. Did that change your mind or mold you in any way? And we've been through this before. I agreed with you. That ISN'T CRT. If you think it is, you are really pig ignorant (thank you pondy) about the whole theory. I've even given you the basic material and history of it. If there's nothing wrong with it, I was correct. You're a MARXIST.


  3. by Curt_Anderson on November 30, 2022 11:50 am
    One of my college professors, back in the seventies, posited that race is an artificial construct and doesn't exist. Of course, most of the class vehemently disagreed. When she asked for somebody to define race somebody said skin color. She pointed out that some African-Americans have lighter skin than some people in India, for example. She exceptions for every defining characteristic offered.

    I don't agree that race doesn't exist, but it was thought provoking and I still remember it.


  4. by Donna on November 30, 2022 11:55 am

    "You "say" you've been a victim of homophobes. Got it. Did that change your mind or mold you in any way? And we've been through this before. I agreed with you. That ISN'T CRT. If you think it is, you are really pig ignorant (thank you pondy) about the whole theory." - od

    I've never said that I'm a "victim of homophobes" per se, but I was discriminated against a couple of times many years ago. No big deal - I moved on. Of course that isn't CRT. Never thought it was. Where did you get that? Why are you asking?




  5. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 11:57 am
    Curt- Again, we already went over this.
    "...in which the person played no part, committed in the past by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex."

    This is a good reason for you and Donna to HATE this bill. You continually blame others by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex" pretty continually, but only if they're conservatives. Your adamant support of rewriting history is appalling to me. Same thing with your support of CRT. And since you support CRT, as a white male, you need to go to Canada and ask them to end your life for you. One down, several million to go.


  6. by Donna on November 30, 2022 12:12 pm

    "You continually blame others by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex" pretty continually, but only if they're conservatives." - od

    I do? I don't even know what you mean by that. Could you clarify and give us some examples of whatever it is you're complaining about?




  7. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 12:15 pm
    Lead and I (and all conservatives) saying that we support the J6 attack.
    and many, many, many other things that you group us all in when we've been very clear on our positions.


  8. by Donna on November 30, 2022 12:24 pm

    I accused you and Hts of downplaying the J6 insurrection, but I don't remember accusing you and all conservatives of supporting it.


  9. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 1:05 pm
    Oh yeah.


  10. by Curt_Anderson on November 30, 2022 1:20 pm
    "...in which the person played no part, committed in the past by other members of the same race, color, national origin, or sex." ---OD

    Read the entire paragraph which you partially quoted. It's all about conservative snowflakes' feelings being hurt.

    Some of my ancestors were Scandinavian. I don't feel guilty or remorse when historians discuss the plundering and pillaging by the Vikings. I am also part German. I don't have personal anguish over Nazi atrocities.

    Also, how ignorant are these kids of snowflake families? Are they shocked and dismayed to learn in school that Black people were enslaved in this country? Are they unaware of Jim Crow laws? If so-called CRT gets people that upset, it's good evidence that they need exposure to historical realities.



  11. by HatetheSwamp on November 30, 2022 1:25 pm

    I don't understand why you progressive Swampcultists are so defensive and protective of CRT.

    When the core ideas of the theory were taught to, even, elementary school students remotely, during the pandemic and parents observed it, they were revolted. In the end, that dweeb fascist who runs the DOJ unleashed the FBI to investigate parents who were showing up at public school board meetings to protest it.

    And, I just don't get it. Why is this a Blue MAGA Swampcult cause celebre? Can one of you rallying to the defense of this understanding of history that is so offensive and objectionable to so many, splain what gets your heart a thumpin?


  12. by Donna on November 30, 2022 1:31 pm

    And we don't understand why you're all so worked up about it.

    Core tenets of CRT

    From the American Bar Association, Purdue University, and Brittanica

    The belief that race is a culturally invented category used to oppress people of color.

    The law and legal institutions in the United States are inherently racist insofar as they function to create and maintain social, political, and economic inequalities between white and nonwhite people.

    Rejection of popular understandings about racism, such as arguments that confine racism to a few “bad apples.” CRT recognizes that racism is codified in law, embedded in structures, and woven into public policy. CRT rejects claims of meritocracy or “colorblindness.” CRT recognizes that it is the systemic nature of racism that bears primary responsibility for reproducing racial inequality.

    Recognition of the relevance of people’s everyday lives to scholarship. This includes embracing the lived experiences of people of color, including those preserved through storytelling, and rejecting deficit-informed research that excludes the epistemologies of people of color.


    Hts - Which core ideas of those core tenets are being taught to K-5 children?

    crossing-the-divide.org


  13. by HatetheSwamp on November 30, 2022 1:39 pm

    Donna,

    Based on what parents who screamed and shouted at school board members, were objecting to during the pandemic, their young children were being indoctrinated by all of that garbage.

    Those mommies and daddies all, of course, could have been lying. Seems unlikely, though.


  14. by Curt_Anderson on November 30, 2022 1:48 pm
    HtS,
    Nobody is defensive and protective of CRT being taught in public schools. It isn't.

    What liberals and progressives are protective of is the First Amendment. The purpose of the free speech provision of First Amendment is to protect speech which might offend or upset some people. It's not needed to protect the right to say "have a nice day, Mrs. Magillicutty". You and other are upset that certain historical facts might upset conservative snowflakes. In particular it might challenge their whitewashed version of history in which the Civil War was nothing more than a conflict about states rights.


  15. by Donna on November 30, 2022 2:08 pm

    "Nobody is defensive and protective of CRT being taught in public schools. It isn't." - Curt

    Many teachers and administrators claim it is, though. The problem is that CRT is one of those things which, because it's so loosely defined, people attach all kinds of ideas to it out of ignorance or for political advantage.



  16. by HatetheSwamp on November 30, 2022 2:20 pm

    Curt,

    You standing up for the First Amendment is rich. The freedom to exercise one's religion appears in the first Amendment before freedom of speech. I'm gunna guess that you don't support Christians teaching the Virgin Birth in a public school as a First Amendment right.

    This is not a First Amendment issue.


  17. by Curt_Anderson on November 30, 2022 2:52 pm
    “I'm gunna guess that you don't support Christians teaching the Virgin Birth in a public school as a First Amendment right.” —HtS

    Correct. That is a First Amendment issue. Establishment of a religion…


  18. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 6:12 pm
    No, it doesn't. It says that you have the FREEDOM OF RELIGION, not the freedom from religion. The rest was a letter from Jefferson to a religious community. Another made up LIE from the left (and MARXISTS).


  19. by Curt_Anderson on November 30, 2022 6:40 pm
    No, it does not say that. The First, like the other amendments is not a list of freedoms that we are allowed to have. It's a list of what government cannot do to restrict our freedoms which are considered unalienable. Here is what the First says:
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    That means that the government including its myriad of parts cannot promote, advocate for or against any particular religion or religion beliefs. That's why the Supreme Court ruled that organized and teacher-led prayers are not permitted in public, government-funded schools. However the students are free to pray, discuss the Bible, Koran, etc. on their own.


  20. by oldedude on November 30, 2022 7:05 pm
    Okay, I'm tired of you (the expert on constitutional law) arguing just to argue. You whine and biatch about me, but you never look inward.


  21. by HatetheSwamp on December 1, 2022 3:27 am

    But, Curt, if it's free speech, a teacher would be able to teach the Virgin Birth!!!!!?


  22. by Donna on December 1, 2022 6:05 am

    Of course you're correct, Curt, despite the nebulous complaints.



  23. by HatetheSwamp on December 1, 2022 6:26 am

    I'm pretty sure that Curt's never been more irrational, illogical and WRONG.


  24. by Donna on December 1, 2022 6:26 am

    What did he say there that's wrong?


  25. by HatetheSwamp on December 1, 2022 6:59 am

    How would po say it? Inequitable comparison?

    He's equating the prohibition against school sanctioned and teacher led prayer in public school with a Christian teacher, as a matter of free speech, teaching the Virgin Birth.

    If a teacher can foist a racist theory of history on students as free speech, teachers can also employ the right of free speech to teach a Christian belief. There's no establishment of religion. Just freedom.


  26. by Donna on December 1, 2022 7:52 am

    Unlike you, I'm not a Constitutional scholar, but I'm pretty sure that legal precedent supports what Curt's saying because CRT isn't a religion.

    Using your argument, I guess we should outlaw all public school teachers who teach any contested theories. I can think of oodles of contested theories in science, especially physics.


  27. by HatetheSwamp on December 1, 2022 8:03 am

    pb thinks that it's constitutional for the PUBLIC, i.e., "the people and their representatives" to determine what is appropriate material in PUBLIC EDUCATION.

    pb doesn't think that it's free speech for a Christian to promote a Christian doctrine in a PUBLIC SCHOOL because, in a public school, employee's speech ain't free. PUBLIC school teachers work for the people. In the same way, teaching a prohibited and racist interpretation of history isn't a free speech right...in a PUBLIC school.


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